Aloha Dessa!
Sorry I wasn't able to respond immediately - However I see you did get an EXCELLENT response from Mike Brown !! Actually Dessa I couldn't have said it better myself...especially seeing as I use a MAC & Mike uses a PC - as you do ;)
Mike mentioned:
<<<<<<Re file organizing. Ask 10 different people, etc. Generally, the advice I've read says to mimic your paper files.>>>>>>>
Dessa - this is a *very* good suggestion...try not to re-invent the wheel because one medium is paper & the other electronic per say. A good suggestion would be to go *generic* at first when organizing your computer files & continue building from there. If you find you are having a problem locating a file...that is a sure sign telling you it's time to break some topics down into more "chewable chunks ;)
As Mike stated: "... once you've set up a system, you're going to keep fiddling with it and tweaking it as your big picture changes.>>>>>>
<<<<DON'T file according to WHERE the stuff came from (CServe, Internet, scanning, subdirectories of programs you use) but HOW you're going to use the information. >>>>
EXCELLENT!!!!!!
I know it may appear logical when one may be downloading the info...but the idea is for YOU to be able to locate it lickety-split. By gathering info by the *source* this may not serve you in locating that needed info in a snap!
<<<<Avoid a directory named MISC; these become black holes. Find a place for every bit of info.>>>>>
Oooooooooo - Mike must be very organized! This is so true! "Miscellaneous" is actually a title given to a category when one fails to make a real decision about it...from my experience :)
Misc. is definitely *not* the place to bury a one-of-a-kind file...pick the closest generic title you have for it. *OR* think of the FIRST word that comes to mind when you read it - THAT is the sure way of being able to locate the file ;)
<<<<< I also have a directory called APPS which contains all of the applications I use. Generally, you need only back up this stuff once in a blue moon becuase (presumably) you or your system administrator has the original disks and can re-install everything in case of a crash.>>>>>>>>
Very well stated! Regardless of being a PC or MAC user!
<<<<I try not to keep important data under the application's directory.>>>>
On my MAC I *never* keep any data file in an application directory/folder. As a matter of fact all applications are self contained. I've created aliases to access these apps. in my drop down menu. Don't know if there is a similiar feature on a PC.
For example I have 10 main directories/file folders in *my* active portion (biz related),that branch out into multiple sub-sub-sub directories/folders...in total containing 831 files..& I never have a problem finding any one of them. ;) Yes- I have alot of work on this baby in varying categories :D
<<<<BACKUP ROUTINE
You have to decide this for yourself, but I believe the usual advice is to run an incremental or differential backup every day (esp against your data files, not as important with your applications) with a full backup every week (or month, if you feel lucky)>>>>
It only takes being burnt 1x to realize the importance of this procedure...the law of probability will bite anyone...eventually :) Enter: Norton :)
Dessa, you stated:
<<<<<<<<But my real difficulty is finding/keeping track of files and activities. I'd like to be able to recapture correspondance by client, or research by topic, etc. It would be nice to be able to archive files by topic or client in some sort of consistent way, so that I could restore them if and when needed easily. >>>>>>>>>
I do believe PaperMaster is the answer to your prayers Dessa! Not available to MAC users ;(
Sooooo, my FastFind & Retrieve it fill in the void in the interim! I'm *sure* Sam can help you out!
Hope something here helps! Let me know if there is further assistance you need!
Aloha,
Julie Signore - NAPO member
<<Sorry I wasn't able to respond immediately - However I see you did get an EXCELLENT response from Mike Brown !! Actually Dessa I couldn't have said it better myself...especially seeing as I use a MAC & Mike uses a PC - as you do ;)>>
Well, thank you! Yes, I read lots of organizing texts, etc. SLOWLY, they have crept into my habits and life! <g>
BTW, I use a Mac and a PC at work. I use the same principles on both, but enjoy (and curse) the longer file names available on the Mac.
meb
Aloha Mike!
Hmmmmm Enjoy/Curse the longer names of a MAC? May I ask what you find to be a hinderance in the longer name fields available on a MAC ? Just curious ;)
I found your statement about using a MAC at home & a PC at work humorous...which came first? Also, have you ever used *retrieve it* on the MAC....excellent little pgm. !! ;)
I do the billing for my hubby's biz & when I need to find something re: his client it is very difficult at times...*retrieve it* to the rescue & viola! in seconds I have the report I need to mail out! (he organizes his HD to suit his needs...& sometimes it makes no sense to me...so *retrieve it* keeps us both happy) :D
Aloha,
Julie Signore
Clarification: I use a Mac & PC at my office. I only have an underpowered PC at home. <g>
Long file names...Well, it gets political/philosophical with me. I'm more wired for DOS/Windows than I am for the Mac, and the discipline of 8.3 file names encourages organization.
For example, I preface all my readme files with "r" and all my memos with "@" so that when I sort the directory listing, they're all grouped together. For example: "r2_vwr.doc" tells me this is draft 2 of my readme file for the viewer product. (My conventions include an _ and three letters describing the project.)
On the Mac, well, I always have to do LOTS of clicking to get to the folder I want (I use folders as part of my organizaing strategy). Seeing all that space makes me want to type "Viewer readme draft 02" or "Draft 03 viewer readme". I tend to lose the consistency of naming related files because I can expand the name.
Lately, I've tried to impose my naming convention on my mac files, but it doesn't "feel" right on the Mac. I'm still exploring.
Never heard of retrieve it. Is it sold through the mac catalogs?
PS I didn't speak Cobol either Dessa :) I was a Hardware/Software specialist...so it was more Jes2, Jes3, MVS, ISPF etc...:) Gosh a MAC is so much more fun !!!!!
Thanks very much for the ideas, Julie! Actually I do have Norton (is there a Windows version -- I use the DOS version?), and I have a Colorado tape backup systems which works reasonably well, but I like the idea of making an external drive my backup. With W95 coming up, even my gig drive is looking cramped, alas.
But my real difficulty is finding/keeping track of files and activities. I'd like to be able to recaoture correspondance by client, or research by topic, etc. It would be nice to be able to archive files by topic or client in some sort of consistent way, so that I could restore them if and when needed easily. As it is, I have files all over my hard disk -- downloads from CIS, the internet, scanned documents, faxes, e-mail and correspondance, all of it buried willy-nilly in sub-directories based on the software, not on subject matter or client.
I will definitely pursue Sam Hahn, as you suggest.
PS, I was once in MIS as well, though I think it was a case of "if you can't lick 'em, hire 'em". I came from the user side, and it wasn't always entirely comfortable, especially since I don't speak Cobol...
Ready for a long message? <g>
NORTON UTILITIES
Re Norton. There is a Norton Utilities for the PC (recommended), but backup software isn't included. There is Norton Backup for PC/Norton Backup for Windows (two different products) that can talk to your Colorado (I have the Coloroado 250 Jumbo). If you have IBM's PC-DOS, the backup utility there will talk to your Jumbo; MS-DOS's backup utility, bless its pointy little head, doesn't talk to tape drives.
Most any good backup software will contain info on full, incremental, and differential backups and what makes the most sense to use. (My dim memory tells me that incremental is good if you work with lots of different files everyday, while differential is good if you work with the same files everyday, but somebody please check me on that.)
HARD DISK ORGANIZATION
Re file organizing. Ask 10 different people, etc. Generally, the advice I've read says to mimic your paper files. The duplication reduces confusion. SO--if you have a paper folder for Project A and subfolders for SubA, SubB, etc., then on your hard disk you'd have a directory for \ProjectA, then subdirs \ProjectA\SubA, \ProjectA\SubB, etc.
If you have paper files related to the subjects you care most about, and these are the subjects you're downloading files about, then do the same thing: create appropriate directories, subdirs, etc.
DATA FILES
On my work PC, I have a directory called !PROJ for projects. (The ! makes the directory name jump to the top of any File|Open dialog box.) Under that I have directories for my various work projects. Also, directories for misc text files. Use the subdirectories to help you with your naming/organizing scheme (ie, !PROJ\INVOICE\1995\AUG\file.xls).
DON'T file according to WHERE the stuff came from (CServe, Internet, scanning, subdirectories of programs you use) but HOW you're going to use the information.
Also, use the $10/$5/$1 grading scale for the data you download: which file is a $10 file (and consequently more valuable to you)? Your invoice or the latest newsgroup messages? Do you need to back up $1 files? Obviously, these priorities change over time; that $1 file could come in quite handy for that $10K project; but for now, today, what files are worth more to you?
Avoid a directory named MISC; these become black holes. Find a place for every bit of info.
So, tagging all my data for backup is easy: everything in !PROJ.
APPLICATIONS
My work PC has lots of dirs off the root for network stuff, video drivers, etc. I also have a directory called APPS which contains all of the applications I use. Generally, you need only back up this stuff once in a blue moon becuase (presumably) you or your system administrator has the original disks and can re-install everything in case of a crash.
I try not to keep important data under the application's directory. However, I do bend this rule myself at home. I use the OZCIS offline navigator, which prefers being in the root directory. For simplicity's sake, I have all of my forum messages and files in subdirs under OZCIS. (When you set up your backup software, you can specify which directories/files you always want backed up; for me, this is one of those directories.)
Of course, this \APPS organization all goes to hell when you run patches or upgrades on an application that changes some but not all files. Also, there are preference files, INI files, etc., that get updated when you make changes in an application. This can be a headache if you want to restore your hard disk to the way it was yesterday.
Whenever I get a patch in the mail or through Compusrve, I've taken to putting it on a diskette by itself and keeping it with the original application diskettes. That way, everything can stay updated.
Always back up your \WINDOWS directory and the files and subdirs under it. When you install apps, they invariably make changes here.
BACKUP ROUTINE
You have to decide this for yourself, but I believe the usual advice is to run an incremental or differential backup every day (esp against your data files, not as important with your applications) with a full backup every week (or month, if you feel lucky).
ONGOING ORGANIZING
Also, realize that once you've set up a system, you're going to keep fiddling with it and tweaking it as your big picture changes.
Whew! Lotsa verbiage! <g> Hope you find some of it useful.
meb
Hi Mike! Just the info I needed! Many thanks for the thoughtful lengthy reply. I will take your advice on file organization and backup, though I will have to experiment with my Word files -- I assume Word will let me point to the appropriate files. Also thanks for the ideas about backing up Windows -- I will be sure to do include those directories with my regular updates.
Which brings me to another housekeeping question you may have thoughts on. My husband advises me that it is better to restrict the number of root directories, and to park applications in sub-directories. Do you agree? If so, do you have any preferences for where to put which apps?
Dessa,
I'd like to add to your question for Mike, if I may. *How* to create root,, dir and subdir. using windows. I follow the method of grouping by type and breaking it down as needed, just like paper files. It's the step-by-step that has this computer novice stumpped.
TIA
Traci Thomasson - NAPO member
<<I'd like to add to your question for Mike, if I may.>>
One to a customer. <g>
<<*How* to create root,, dir and subdir. using windows. I follow the method of grouping by type and breaking it down as needed, just like paper files. It's the step-by-step that has this computer novice stumpped.>>
ROOT
You don't need to create this; it's already there--C:\. The lone backslash (\) signifies this is the root directory. In DOS, you could be 12 subdirectories deep, and type CD \, and you'd instantly move to the root directory. No problem.
DIRECTORY, SUBDIRECTORY
Well, semantics and nomenclature at work here. A subdirectory *is* a directory, but it's SUBordinate to a parent directory. In C:\APPS\WINWORD, WINWORD is a subdirectory of the APPS directory. In C:\APPS\WINWORD\STARTUP, I could say that STARTUP is a subdirectory of the WINWORD directory. You see, WINWORD can be both a directory *and* a subdirectory; it kind of depends on what's important to you at the time.
FILE MANAGER
Use Windows File Manager to create directories. You should see the File Manager icon (looks like a file cabinet) (isn't that clever?) in your Main program group. Double-click on it.
You should see a view of your hard disk directories and files in the form of a tree. If not, under the View menu, select "Tree and Directory."
For details on creating directories, select Help from the menu bar and select Contents. Under the How to... section, click on "Work with Files and Directories." There are full instructions there.
Basically, to create a directory, click on an existing directory in File Manager to highlight the directory, select File|Create Directory, and type in an 8-chracter name.
Example: Click on the C:\ folder in File Manager. It's highlighted. Select File|Create Directory and enter FOOBAR. Click OK. A folder named FOOBAR should appear in the list of folders under C:\. You've just created a directory! (Windows shows directories on your hard disk as folders.)
Click on FOOBAR so it's highlighted. Select File|Create Directory and enter BARFOO. Click OK. A folder named BARFOO should appear below the FOOBAR directory. You've just created a subdirectory!
Of course, neither Windows nor DOS will let you have duplicate folder names in the same directory.
Will this get you started?
meb
<<Hi Mike! Just the info I needed! Many thanks for the thoughtful lengthy reply.>>
Accent "lengthy" <g> Glad you found it helpful.
<<I will take your advice on file organization and backup, though I will have to experiment with my Word files -- I assume Word will let me point to the appropriate files.>>
I'm assuming you're using WinWord. Select Tools|Options and click on the File Locations tab. The first entry there is for Documents. Highlight it and click on Modify. Select the directory that'll be the primary location of most of your documents. (I have mine set to C:\!PROJ because most of my created documents are located in subdirectories under !PROJ. I can easily navigate to wherever I need to go from there.)
Note that you can also specify diffrent locations for templates, etc. If you create/modify your templates a lot and need quick access to them, you might want to locate them in a \!PROJ\TEMPLATE directory or some such. If you're fine with where your templates are now, then don't worry about it.
You might also want to investigate two add-ons for WinWord: WOPR or MegaWord. Both of them add neat capabilities to Word, but in their own ways. Both of them have ways to modify the File|Open command so that you can specify favorite or most-used directories. You can then travel to those directories with the click of a button. (GO WOPR to get to their forum; they're shareware products and have demo versions available for download. I think MegaWord is a little easier to use and install, but WOPR does some jaw-dropping stuff.)
<<Which brings me to another housekeeping question you may have thoughts on. My husband advises me that it is better to restrict the number of root directories, and to park applications in sub-directories. Do you agree? If so, do you have any preferences for where to put which apps?>>
The root directory (C:\) can only hold 512 entries (this includes files, directories, and hidden files); a subdirectory, however, can hold a virtually limitless number of entries (in the thousands? I can't remember).
My general rule of thumb is, unless necessary, keep the root directory as clean as possible. My root dir has my startup files, my Windows swap file, a few other files needed by Windows or DOS utility programs, and that's it. After that are the subdirectories (my filing cabinets, if you will) where I store my stuff.
Here's a sample of subdirectoreis off my work PC:
C:\
!PROJ\ <--contains subdirs for my various projects
and reference files
APPS\<--contains all of my application and utility programs,
with appropriate subdirs for each app. I once had a
separate subdir for utilities, but in the interest of
simplicity I dump them all here.
TEMP\<--a temporary directory for zip files. Also have an
environmental variable set to this directory.
BATCH\<--all my batch files.
DOS\<--DOS files
WINDOWS<--what else?
There are also other directories off the root that contain video driver and cd-rom files. The PC came with lots of stuff pre-installed and pre-configured; everything works and I haven't had the guts to dig in there and change them <g>.
I prefer dumping each app in its own subdirectory rather than breaking them down by subdirs according to word processing, database, spreadsheet, etc. That's an artificial way to segregate work, to me. Also, I'm still a command-line user, and typing C:\APPS\WINWORD is quicker than C:\APPS\WORDPROC\WINWORD.
WARNING:Don't move apps in Windows casually. A lot of these programs have hard-wired WIN.INI or their own INI files to their current file locations. If you move a program from its current directory to a new directory, you might see the APPLICATION NOT FOUND error when you click on its icon. (You might be able to move smaller programs around a lot easier than a monster program like Word.) (It was so much easier in the days of DOS. Sigh.) (Also easier on the Mac.)
I'm afraid I don't have a quick remedy for that situation, apart from removing the program and reinstalling it to a new location. There might be some shareware programs out there that could help with the move. I've been filing my stuff this way for so long that I've never encountered this problem much.
Dear Mike and Julie-- You guys are wonderful! It will take me a while to digest your recommendations, but in the meantime, it's a such a treasure to get so much useful, thoughtful, thorough advice. Thanks very, very much.
Dessa